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Post by CephaSquiddy on Aug 12, 2010 18:24:37 GMT
What's Loplod doing now?
O.o
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Post by Magical Baker on Aug 12, 2010 19:34:26 GMT
I and loplod changed for a bit. But we got busted pretty quick.
Cheers!
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Post by Julio on Aug 12, 2010 19:42:04 GMT
Dick move, I do say. Dick move indeed.
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Post by salamut2202 on Aug 12, 2010 20:38:04 GMT
Thlaylie wrote: But to what shall I liken this generation? It is like children sitting in the marketplaces and calling to their companions, "and saying:
'We played the flute for you And you did not dance: We mourned to you And you did not lament.""...We trolled And you did not flame." Seriously, being back to work full time, and taking care of my kids, doesn't leave much time for online socializing. I've been here more than anywhere else online the past few days. moar irony! inside irony too. like an inside joke but ironic and it's so inside i probably am the only one who gets it completely.
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Post by braid on Aug 12, 2010 20:53:07 GMT
Thlaylie wrote: But to what shall I liken this generation? It is like children sitting in the marketplaces and calling to their companions, "and saying:
'We played the flute for you And you did not dance: We mourned to you And you did not lament.""...We trolled And you did not flame." Seriously, being back to work full time, and taking care of my kids, doesn't leave much time for online socializing. I've been here more than anywhere else online the past few days. moar irony! inside irony too. like an inside joke but ironic and it's so inside i probably am the only one who gets it completely. Wormwood never gave me the impression of a Troll on The Great Hive. It might not be him. Sort of like Loplod previously. Sort of like me.
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Post by salamut2202 on Aug 12, 2010 21:17:16 GMT
?
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Post by CephaSquiddy on Aug 12, 2010 21:57:37 GMT
Oh Tim you sneaky...
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Post by psychichobo on Aug 12, 2010 23:37:19 GMT
Yeah, this thread stopped making sense pretty fast. Oh wells.
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Post by alice on Aug 12, 2010 23:47:00 GMT
Don't worry. The others will soon follow
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Post by Enigma on Aug 12, 2010 23:59:42 GMT
When this started it was the Mind saying that he's dissapointed at us leaving... then it was the Mind saying that he'd fix this "rift" (I don't think it's there personally: I go to OldGen every once in a while too, and the rest of the Hive). Then it was us bashing Yori. And now it's this.
So, anyone up for some ping pong?
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Post by coff on Aug 13, 2010 4:11:08 GMT
I read the initial post and every following post afterward in this thread and have spent about an hour mulling it over and the general sentiments of the members of both TTH and this site. I've done my best to come up with an intelligent and well thought out post. Then I went and got a six pack of beer and have drank two of them thus far and am working on number three. After all "in vino veritas". So now I'm going to proceed to get real and piss some people off. (Rule 1 Broken).
Who is to blame for the flaws with TTH General? All of us.
I see a lot of loathing pointed at Yori here. As far as I'm concerned in this conflict he has been nothing but Lawful Neutral. He certainly knows the rules of the forum. Better than I do. He enforces them. As they are. Perhaps he has became more dogmatic or strict recently but can you blame him?
Which leads me to the next group worth pointing a finger at. The instigators. You know who you are. The self-titled "Regulars". (beer #3 done). In case we're not clear, Sal deliberately baited mods to get threads locked, Trygon and Dangeresque flamed the RP board for a while, Thlaylie seems to take joy in pissing people off and has no regards for courtesy when it comes to debating. I didn't invent these. The mods received a lot of complaints about these particular members. If Yori has become overzealous over the past year or two it is due to the posting habits of these members in particular (and possibly a few others).
Lastly the blame goes to the apathetic. Myself included. After the hype of 4th ed and the thrill of being the top poster wore off, my visitations to the site waned. As a mod I should've checked more often but my visitations dropped to once every month or two and often I didn't even bother posting. The "back in the day" General we all miss was one that hardly needed moderating. (beer #4 done) I used my moderator privileges to censor those who dodged the swear filter and correct misspellings. That's pretty much it. Had I been more attentive I could've warned flaming trolls that their actions were drawing ire and prevented them from becoming regulars at the activity.
It's not just me though. The Hive Mind could've checked the site more often. Other members could've sent more messages to more mods. Both regarding the actions of the flaming trolls and Yori's crusade. Other mods could've been more attentive to these concerns also.
We're all to blame. The biggest part of maintaining a community is acting like one. To repair the community we need to start working together as a community to find solutions and treating all of us with the same respect. For example I tried not to exclude anyone from my tirade. Some of us need to grow a thicker skin and other of us need to be a bit nicer. My general advice is for everyone to be a little more lax. It's taken me far in life.
I'd like to see the community restored to it's circa 2006 status and I agree with every point The Hive Mind made. If anyone has suggestions as to how to accomplish that feel free to discuss them here or there. I'll check both.
Now if I'm not banned yet I'll go about posting in the other threads.
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Post by Thlaylie on Aug 13, 2010 4:36:13 GMT
It's nice to be mentioned, but I have been nice here and back at the Hive lately.
Don't give me a reason to revert.
If you must mention my negative actions of the past, research my current behavior and give that equal mention.
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Post by coff on Aug 13, 2010 5:23:15 GMT
Don't give me a reason to revert. Ok, Thlaylie. I had a very long post I was about to make citing your recent defenses of yourself not being harsh (though it was perceived as others to be so) and your constant references to people as idiots and unfaltering insistence you are right in a debate that you have no authority on. But this quote by you sums up my point. You may be trying harder to be less rude but you clearly admit to rudeness. We as a community need to cut this crap out.
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Post by Poly on Aug 13, 2010 6:13:15 GMT
I'd like to make a serious suggestion to The Hive.
I think it would behoove every Hiver, to have had the rules edited to include "PM's fall under this rule" somewhere in the rules for advertising. Otherwise some poor Hiver might get the wrong idea and be in the same sinking boat as me. We already know how rational Yoritomo is. Hivey, you could one-up Yoritomo by listening to the community, as well as admit TTH's rules weren't quite as clear as you would've liked them to have been. I wouldn't hold anything against anyone for what, to me, seems like a simple misunderstanding. I admit, there were were other venues toward a solution. I should have been more respectful to the man who brought TTH to the internet, although you weren't* as active, you obviously care. I'm wondering though, will I be perma-banned for this?
I'm not trying to sound threatening, I'm just posing a question... How will The Hive view me getting perma-banned for a rule that did not clearly state it's boundaries? The reset went over well as we can all see. I'm just wondering how a perma-ban is even an option. This was my 1st & only offense. Others have broken rules that were clearly written, & have lived to tell the tale. Hivey, you do have right to be mad, but in my defense, I didn't know I was breaking a rule until I was already banned for it. It still hasn't been edited to say PM's, but I imagine it will before my ban is up. I reacted the way I did on this thread out of anger, I missed a few key points.
I am sorry it came to this, not just my ban, but for everything. I view it as a misunderstanding evoked by poor communication, on both our parts. Dangeresque made a How "Can We Fix It?" thread, this was one of many red flags that we were sinking. We have been discussing the state of General for the last few months now, it's not like we were plotting against anyone. We don't like this anymore than you do, & that's the honest to God truth. I really want to have a peace treaty to say, we are both level headed adults who can admit they've made a mistake. It would be viewed as an end to all this. At least in my case, I can't speak on anyone else's behalf.
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Post by FungusA on Aug 13, 2010 9:46:05 GMT
I personally think, this is the internet, shit happens, and we helped fix it, there isn't much more need for debate here. Keeping general on a seperate forum fixes a lot of problems, and when weighed up, the pros are much more than the cons.
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Post by Dangeresque on Aug 13, 2010 10:45:22 GMT
I read the initial post and every following post afterward in this thread and have spent about an hour mulling it over and the general sentiments of the members of both TTH and this site. I've done my best to come up with an intelligent and well thought out post. Then I went and got a six pack of beer and have drank two of them thus far and am working on number three. After all "in vino veritas". So now I'm going to proceed to get real and piss some people off. (Rule 1 Broken). Who is to blame for the flaws with TTH General? All of us. I see a lot of loathing pointed at Yori here. As far as I'm concerned in this conflict he has been nothing but Lawful Neutral. He certainly knows the rules of the forum. Better than I do. He enforces them. As they are. Perhaps he has became more dogmatic or strict recently but can you blame him? Which leads me to the next group worth pointing a finger at. The instigators. You know who you are. The self-titled "Regulars". (beer #3 done). In case we're not clear, Sal deliberately baited mods to get threads locked, Trygon and Dangeresque flamed the RP board for a while, Thlaylie seems to take joy in pissing people off and has no regards for courtesy when it comes to debating. I didn't invent these. The mods received a lot of complaints about these particular members. If Yori has become overzealous over the past year or two it is due to the posting habits of these members in particular (and possibly a few others). Lastly the blame goes to the apathetic. Myself included. After the hype of 4th ed and the thrill of being the top poster wore off, my visitations to the site waned. As a mod I should've checked more often but my visitations dropped to once every month or two and often I didn't even bother posting. The "back in the day" General we all miss was one that hardly needed moderating. (beer #4 done) I used my moderator privileges to censor those who dodged the swear filter and correct misspellings. That's pretty much it. Had I been more attentive I could've warned flaming trolls that their actions were drawing ire and prevented them from becoming regulars at the activity. It's not just me though. The Hive Mind could've checked the site more often. Other members could've sent more messages to more mods. Both regarding the actions of the flaming trolls and Yori's crusade. Other mods could've been more attentive to these concerns also. We're all to blame. The biggest part of maintaining a community is acting like one. To repair the community we need to start working together as a community to find solutions and treating all of us with the same respect. For example I tried not to exclude anyone from my tirade. Some of us need to grow a thicker skin and other of us need to be a bit nicer. My general advice is for everyone to be a little more lax. It's taken me far in life. I'd like to see the community restored to it's circa 2006 status and I agree with every point The Hive Mind made. If anyone has suggestions as to how to accomplish that feel free to discuss them here or there. I'll check both. Now if I'm not banned yet I'll go about posting in the other threads. Banned? No! That's not how things work here! Oh, such prejudice though... the problems you've mentioned all occured after THE problem. I could go into what it is, but what's the point? All you need to know is that it's been fixed. As for you being a better mod than you were, you were better for not moderating. It was strict moderation that sent the thing crashing down, with a distinct sense of "No mod gives a shit about general" to seal the corpses casket. Problem solved! We ain't connecting to the Hive either! All is good and well! Enjoy your stay!
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Post by Vespid on Aug 14, 2010 6:29:45 GMT
Here is a direct hack'n'slap of mine from a discussion that we are having on TTH
Despite being apparently wrong in hindsight, I still think that the reset and toughening up of the General board was the right move. Over the past few months, things devolved and quite a few things that we usually let go unchecked got out of hand. We went from one or two people who occasionally trolled, and were generally shut down by the community voices, to maybe six or seven major ones. Could we have just started banning them? Well... we did and apparently it did not work as well as planned... and then they multiplied. Could we have handled it better? Yeah, probably. Maybe a post saying "Hey guys, General board reset in a week... and we are becoming more strict on trolling while we are at it" would have been merited. However, I still think that it was a good idea. People will be back. Things will start to grow again. Those who are so disaffected to the decision that they are not coming back may or may not be worth losing in order to restore a little bit of order to the former chaos. And then we will have the newbies joining up. Speaking from personal experience, I did not really look at all at the general board for maybe a year before I started becoming a regular there. If there are people in a similar situation, then it will re-grow.
I would also requote Coff's posts here and in the discussion that we are having, but that chews up a substantial amount of screen space... So just know that what Coff has typed on this page is, in my opinion, sensible and truth. Poly: It should not matter what form it takes, be it by PM or by a thread. Advertising is Advertising and, by the rules, you got pinged. The difference is in how. You could send one PM to another person and say "Hey, check this out". Not advertising, but word of mouth/opinion. Send the same message to many people at the same time, it has become advertising. Where is the limit? *shrugs* Does this extend to linking some sites, even in some thread topics? Again, a bit of a blurred area... But the fact of the matter is that both you and Dangeresque (others?) sent a broad message to a lot of people saying "Join this site". That's advertising. Many spam bots that have done such things in the past have been deleted for such things.
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Post by Enigma on Aug 14, 2010 8:27:56 GMT
^ What this one said. Mass emails (and therefore mass PMs) telling people to go to this site is advertising, and in any other situation, I would consider it spam.
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Post by salamut2202 on Aug 14, 2010 9:13:24 GMT
i had ongoing dialogue on the matter so i found such a post run of the mill.
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Post by Thlaylie on Aug 14, 2010 15:10:20 GMT
Don't give me a reason to revert. Ok, Thlaylie. I had a very long post I was about to make citing your recent defenses of yourself not being harsh (though it was perceived as others to be so) and your constant references to people as idiots and unfaltering insistence you are right in a debate that you have no authority on. But this quote by you sums up my point. You may be trying harder to be less rude but you clearly admit to rudeness. We as a community need to cut this crap out. I still feel EXACTLY that way coff, burning fuel at a prodigious rate to maintain niceness. Be gratefull not snitty.
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